July 25, 2017


Drew and I are hearing this list has created a lot of discussion amongst the pigeon sport with opinions on all sides with most of the opinions being supportive.  That is great to hear as we hoped this would be something the sport would be interested in and create some discussion.  We also thought we should address a few of the comments and questions.

Being Added/Removed From the List

We hope that everyone wants to be on the list.  If you aren’t on the list and meet the criteria, please tell us and we will add you (until August 15th).  If you are on the list and don’t want to be, please email Drew and I directly and tell us why you think you should be off the list.  If you advertise and sell birds based upon OLR results then we think it is only fair to the sport and your customers that you remain on the list.  Why would you not want the world to know your results?

Accuracy of Numbers

As we said in the beginning, we all know this is a lot of data to gather, analyze, reformat and distribute.  We will get it wrong at times.  We already were informed of an error in the formula used for Plymouth Peak and will update next time we publish the numbers.  If you see something wrong – PLEASE TELL US!  We also realize that some races took birds in after they said they were done and played some other games with numbers, but we should still be very close to having accurate numbers on the birds.  As far as perch fees/initial entry fees, we had to create some pretty interesting formulas to try to capture the perch fees paid.  We also know people got free perch fees in some races, sent an extra bird with a replacement, got some perch fees refunded if the birds were lost prior to training, etc.  Yea, we can’t build formulas to catch all that especially when we don’t know what is what and we certainly aren’t going to hand figure and try to verify every number.  For those critics of not being 100% accurate, we would like to share a thought with you – “Perfect is the enemy of good.”  We are doing something good, but it won’t be perfect.  Help us make it better and if you see something wrong – PLEASE TELL US!  If you want to sit back and criticize and not help then good for you.  We love you to.  Here are a couple examples from a couple breeders thinking their numbers are wrong.  If they are wrong, please tell us where we are wrong.

“It’s Not All About the Money”

Guess what – WE AGREE!  Money is only one of the factors we are tracking, but to not track money in a one loft statistics tracking project is like calling all 100 birds on the 1st drop on a 100 mile or 200 mile one loft race a “Champion!”  Oh wait, maybe we shouldn’t use that example as that might confuse a few people.  Anyway, it isn’t all about the money and we will have a lot of data and numbers to crunch that have nothing to do with money, but there is a portion of OLR’s that is about the money.  If you are complaining about us tracking the money and use OLR wins and money won to sell pigeons – just stop it!

Future Plans for the Stats Project

Obviously we are in the early stages of this project and our hope is it will accomplish three things:  (1) it will be fun; (2) it will create transparency; and (3) it will establish truth.  We think it will be fun to see throughout the OLR season who is doing well and see races and lofts move up and down the list of statistics we are tracking.  We think it will be fun because we will ask breeders who have birds do well to provide us with pedigrees and information to write up and tell the world about this special bird.  Think of PIPA and how after a national race they have pictures, pedigrees and stories about the breeder and the bird.  Yea, we want that too.

On the transparency, we really believe that transparency will make our sport better.  When people are informed they make better decisions.  They make better decisions on what races to enter.  They make better decisions on what birds to bring into their lofts and try to breed champions with.  They make better decisions on who to talk to and ask “what are you doing to win so much?” All these things will make the sport better!

On establishing truth, we all know the pigeon sport has a lot of people talking about how great their birds are.  We have no problem with that at all.  We think when people think they have the best birds then they have every right to tell the world!  However, if people are saying they accomplished something and it isn’t accurate then we hope the stats project will be a place where people can go look to verify accuracy of representations.  For example, a few years back a breeder was talking and advertising about how he “rocked” and “wiped out” the competition in the PNWC.  I sent a very nice email and told him that our sport needed more honesty, transparency and less marketing hype.  I told him that he did well, but he didn’t “rock” and “wipe out” the competition as I actually won more money in the race than he did so he might want to revisit what he was saying.  I thought no big deal.  Wow, I sure didn’t expect the vile and angry response I got back telling me I was wrong and that he did wipe out the competition.  Funny enough, Mark Mourton told me this breeder sent him a text asking who won the most money that year – it was NRPL.  So here is my point with that story, the stats project should really help with people who make bold claims regarding their results as it will be a place EVERYONE can come visit and find out what is real.

Finally, we just want to say again “Let’s Have Fun!!”  This project will be a lot of fun and we are so appreciative of the many breeders and members of the sport who have thanked us for kicking this off.  Only a few weeks more and we will start having some one loft races and that is when the real fun starts!  Buckle up and hold on for the ride!

Joe Nemelka & Drew Lesofski




8 Responses to OLR STATS PROJECT Q & A

  1. Ross Vaccaro on July 25, 2017 at 3:53 pm

    Please add me and my loft into your statistics

  2. Carlos Valle on July 25, 2017 at 5:08 pm

    Very interesting and helpful. Hope you´d like to share your experience with other International Federations like Mexico.

  3. Tom Fremont on July 25, 2017 at 6:15 pm

    Personally I love this. This is a very good start and I applaud your thought process and efforts. I’ve always felt that these so called ‘Champions’ in One Loft Races were a joke, and a disservice to the sport. Having said that, this now for the first time gives some legitimacy to the outcome and allows the fancy to see a more honest and truthful perspective. HUH ?? Not about money ?? who’s kidding who ?? You take the big $$ away from this game and the game of OLR ceases to exist. That is why I have always said and will continue to say ‘Club Racing’ is still and will always be the purest form of the sport. Is OLR fun ? ..absolutely…and I think in some ways it is a very cool concept…I’ve actually come a long way in my thinking with this. I’m not advocating to get rid of it. BUT this effort by Drew and Joe is a huge step forward to keeping it real and putting it into perspective… Just my opinion… Tom PS I Love the honesty by the boys saying it is not “perfect” but it is very good. you tell me anything about pigeon racing that is perfect…very little..but it is a blast and it is very good…

  4. Mike G. on July 26, 2017 at 12:13 am

    I think this a wonderful attempt to quantify and qualify the OLR races. I don’t like seeing advertisements claiming 1st place winners on TRAINING TOSSES. I understand the attempt to put all the races under a certain set of parameters, but there are half dozens or so OLR’s that are have a some of the highest participation rates from all levels of breeders and very well handled, but are excluded because the races occur after Dec 31st. I think they should be considered, because the entries are still from the same breeding season as the fall races. Thanks and Good luck to all.

    • dlesofski on July 26, 2017 at 9:31 am

      Mike – Joe and my decision to track those races with end dates of Dec. 31 is purely a time management tool. The amount of time to collect and aggregate the information is quite laborious and this is why we developed a set of minimum qualifications for which breeders and OLRs to track. I can assure you we take yours and all the other recommendations seriously and hope in the future to be able to track every single breeder and one loft race.


  5. Kenny Rhodes on July 26, 2017 at 4:56 pm

    I think keeping track of entries is a great idea you guys have and finally with Validity. As Ive seen in the past The OLR Champs have obviously out numbered the entries of all others. A suggestion could also be made to all of the OLR owners is to have a limit on entries per loft to make a level playing field to those who choose not or cant afford to try to BUY The Race. I mentioned to the SAMDPR to possibly limit their entries as some sent 100 plus entries in the past but it was like talking to a wall.

    • Tom Fremont on July 26, 2017 at 7:46 pm

      Kenny with few exceptions there will never be a bird limit imposed. High numbers of birds equals higher revenue for all. When I say the OLR’s are all about money…that goes for the handler as well as the breeder. If I’m a one loft handler in it to make a nice little chunk of change I couldn’t possibly turn down all those extra perch fees. Now again I know there are some exceptions…so I in my opinion those are the ones to support !! I think it would be so good for this aspect of the sport to allow this idea of Joe and Drew to take fruition… which it sounds like most are willing to do so…

  6. Manny Pol on July 26, 2017 at 8:22 pm


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